Curse

FX8 · Aug 05, 2005, 05:24 PM // 17:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spartan2

It is very clear, at this point, that you are not stating what programs you are running while GuildWars is up, how often and how rapidly you change characters in succession, etc.

You could be running numerous programs to eat up your bandwidth and hopefully cause a dupe; you aren't doing anything wrong in-game, just switching items around to "trade", like you said, but outside the game, you are trying to exploit the system.

I've said before, the only program that's on in the background is a virus scanner and the other default windows process (bearing in mind also that my computer has been reloaded only just last week and I do NOT download / run any random program you'll find on the net). The virus scanner happens to be McAfee VirusScan 9 (2005 incase some blames virus scanners). I'm sure I'm not the only person to use McAfee, other than that, there's NO other 3rd party client programs in the background. I'm on a 1MBit ADSL (1024MBit down / 288KBit up) line so lag if definately none or at least very very rare. This is the typical ratio setup for many ISP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hydrak

Second, what has FX8 given to us as proof? I just tested his claim (also see other posts in this thread about log in/outs) by logging in/out about 300 times, and nothing happened to me.

I've shown the first email with me reporting the problem to ANet and their followup to confirm that I did not fabricate this situation. Secondly I did post that this ban occured while I was in town (Lions Arch) not doing anything.

Regarding some posters who shares the idea "ANet must be correct on everything...", those people really make me ask myself if you live in some dictatorship countries where you believe everything you're told. Whatever happened to democracy and the so called "innocent until proven guilty"? How many companies are truly honest and fully respectable? Ultimately reputation / liability is the company's first priority regardless how they obtain that (honesty or coverups, mostly the latter when things go sour). So don't place your trust so blindly in any company.

Another thing, is it just me but some people here seem to think because ANet has provided a free service MMPOG that we should all bow and believe everything ANet says? Regardless of wether the usage is pay / month or free, you cannot ban people without justification / proof. I sure hope you people (you know who you are) aren't as trusting in real life.

Xellos · Aug 05, 2005, 05:27 PM // 17:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aniewiel

I don't think that ArenaNet or NCSoft owes US anything. They don't have to prove their reasoning behind bannings or any action they take against player accounts. This is -their- game and those are -their- servers. If they perceive (note the word perceive) that someone is hacking or that someone is exploiting a loophole or that someone is in violation of the EULA, they have every right to ban the account without warning or publicity. They have told us repeatedly that they will NOT give out details on their punative actions against player accounts.

*shrugs* I am not really taking a stand one way or the other. I leave that in the capable hands of the people who have all the information: FX8 and ANet/NCSoft.

Plain obvious, this is not a p2p game. They can do whatever they want. Hell they can shut down the servers tomorrow and get away with it. What's your point? Go by faith? This is exactly why guys like Ace and GHM are giving up on the game. Faith and hope only go so far for each person, and not everyone is willing to stay long enough for another 1.10 patch at this rate.

I'm completely aware of how the rules work, I'm just trying to force both sides to play by stipulations where only the innocent can come out unscathed. A true test of faith if you will.

hydrak · Aug 05, 2005, 05:30 PM // 17:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by FX8

I've shown the first email with me reporting the problem to ANet and their followup to confirm that I did not fabricate this situation. Secondly I did post that this ban occured while I was in town (Lions Arch) not doing anything.

This indicates that you are not banned by some automated instant-banned machine. ANET probably had looked at your logfile prior to you being idle in Lion Arch, and they might have found something that warranted the banning.

Xellos · Aug 05, 2005, 05:34 PM // 17:34

Both sides are somewhat in a stalemate, as even with character item transfer, unless FX8 can give at least a estimated summary of what he was transfering that took a hundred switches, it's pretty easy to say Anet has the advantage. On the other hand, Anet basing it purely on loggings and just plain ignoring the idea of a "switch character" button which still frusterates some of us is obscene. The reason for a "public trial" is to stop more and more people from taking sides, and getting straight down to the bottom of this. But hey who cares.

Granamyr · Aug 05, 2005, 05:34 PM // 17:34

Quote:

Second, to answer your question, I'm one of those people who don't want ANET to explain publicly why they ban a hacking offender.

You didn't answer my question. Whose question were you referring to?

I don't necessarily want ANet to disclose their security procedures either however that decision carries consequences. Namely, lack of trust. It might be a crummy situation for them but so be it. If they're not willing to give any evidence or justification then we shouldn't trust them. Name a situation in real life where you blindly accept punishment without justification?

hydrak · Aug 05, 2005, 05:44 PM // 17:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xellos

Both sides are somewhat in a stalemate, as even with character item transfer, unless FX8 can give at least a estimated summary of what he was transfering that took a hundred switches, it's pretty easy to say Anet has the advantage. On the other hand, Anet basing it purely on loggings and just plain ignoring the idea of a "switch character" button which still frusterates some of us is obscene. The reason for a "public trial" is to stop more and more people from taking sides, and getting straight down to the bottom of this. But hey who cares.

Adding a "switch character" button is a bad idea. It will open GW (as it has done to other games) to many hacking exploits, particularly duplicating item exploits.

Let me say this one more time. You cannot be banned for logging in/out of your account hundred of times in a short period of time. Logging in/out hundreds of times may raise a red flag on ANET servers for logfile investigation, but you will not be banned if there is no wrong doing. I've tested this.

Del12 · Aug 05, 2005, 05:47 PM // 17:47

I would tend to believe that ANET wouldn't ban someone unless they had absolute evidence of some 'pattern' in their logs that is representative of some violating behavior. So if it's word against word, I would believe them. It's kinda like in prison, if you ask the prisoners, probably 80% are innocent. But in reality, maybe 1% are really innocent. So I would doubt FX8 is one of those exceptions.

Divinitys Creature · Aug 05, 2005, 05:54 PM // 17:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by hydrak

JUST TESTED: I was sitting there logging in and out of my account for 300 times as fast as I can. And Nothing happened to my account. What I just did may raise a red flag and cause a log of my account to be investigated by Anet, but nothing more.

I think you need to do something out of what is considered as normal gameplay many many times to be banned (such as the skill points/experience exploit).

Very few people would go to all that trouble

At least we more info

Granamyr · Aug 05, 2005, 06:03 PM // 18:03

Quote:

I would tend to believe that ANET wouldn't ban someone unless they had absolute evidence of some 'pattern' in their logs that is representative of some violating behavior.

Unfortunately, I think many people have this same viewpoint. I would tend to believe the little guy was telling the truth and the corporation made a mistake. I have a feeling that many people share my viewpoint in real life but for whatever reason, suspend that belief when talking about ANet. It astounds me.

Quote:

So if it's word against word, I would believe them.

Amazing. No evidence to back up ANet. No reason to believe they didn't make a mistake. Nothing but blind faith in an institution. I pray there aren't any cults recruiting in your neighborhood.

Quote:

It's kinda like in prison, if you ask the prisoners, probably 80% are innocent. But in reality, maybe 1% are really innocent.

Almost. It's kinda like in prison where you ask the government if they have any proof that the accused is guilty and they say yes but they won't tell you what it is. That usually raises a red flag for me. I'm surprised it doesn't for you. If FX8 said he had proof that showed he was innocent but wouldn't let you see it, would you trust him?

hydrak · Aug 05, 2005, 06:03 PM // 18:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divinitys Creature

Very few people would go to all that trouble

At least we more info

I did it as fast as I can. With a fast computer and video card, I got about 300 logins in half an hour although I did take a couple of 3-minute breaks in the middle.

Tactical-Dillusions · Aug 05, 2005, 06:03 PM // 18:03

When i'm doing many farming runs over and over and i get the feeling of eyes watching me....i type comments to Anet about how poopy the loot is.

At least if they look at my logs, they can see i'm not a robot. I'm a human with a personality and a taste for shiny weapons.

"What a load of ****, you call that loot Anet?" ROFL

TheGreatBoo · Aug 05, 2005, 06:04 PM // 18:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Granamyr

Out to get Anet, what does that mean? Unappreciative!? Who cares whether I appreciate them or not!? That has nothing to do with this. If I pay for a good or service, I expect to receive that good or service.....appreciation doesn't play a part.

Holding someone's feet to the flame is an expression not meant to be taken literally. Hopefully that assumption of semi-intelligence was not done in error and you are just unfamiliar with English. Hopefully.

It's not even close to being the same. He payed for the game. He got the game. He got to play the game. From what anet is saying they have evidence that he was doing something disallowed by the rules. It's not even near the same. And yes, appreciation does play a part. When you get something, you say thank you. When you want something, you say please. It's called manners. Learn them. Paying for something does not entitle you to walk over someone, which is exactly what you and many other people are attempting to do.

Wow and insult. I was going for what you meant, not literally. You seem to lack human decency. Once again, paying for something does not give you the right to mistreat others. Especially the people providing you with that. Get a job and give a customer something. Then hopefully they'll give you the mistreatment you and many others just gave anet. You've got alot of growin up to do. Open your eyes and learn to put yourself in other peoples shoes.

Damon Windwalker · Aug 05, 2005, 06:08 PM // 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Granamyr

Name a situation in real life where you blindly accept punishment without justification?

...it's called a job.

hydrak · Aug 05, 2005, 06:12 PM // 18:12

Another reminder to everyone here about how innocent FX8 is... He has just registered on this forum. Up to this point in time, all of his posts are in this thread.

Although all his responses are very innocent, I can't help myself seeing some of HIGH CHUNTAYA in him.

FX8 · Aug 05, 2005, 06:31 PM // 18:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by hydrak

Another reminder to everyone here about how innocent FX8 is... He has just registered on this forum. Up to this point in time, all of his posts are in this thread.

Although all his responses are very innocent, I can't help myself seeing some of HIGH CHUNTAYA in him.

You are another typical example of someone who will judge a person based on numbers. Let me enlighten you, a person who's just signed up has the same credibility to a story as a person who has been a member for a year, there's no guarantee that the longtime member would not make a mistake or fabricate a story. I have done what I can (taking privacy into consideration for both myself and ANet) in providing proof. Unfortunately I don't have the luxury of recording my computer and log every action I take, nor is it practical.

SOT · Aug 05, 2005, 06:32 PM // 18:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by hydrak

Another reminder to everyone here about how innocent FX8 is... He has just registered on this forum. Up to this point in time, all of his posts are in this thread.

Although all his responses are very innocent, I can't help myself seeing some of HIGH CHUNTAYA in him.

You avatar screams "agenda" to me

hydrak · Aug 05, 2005, 06:35 PM // 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOT

You avatar screams "agenda" to me

Care to elaborate that?

Xellos · Aug 05, 2005, 06:42 PM // 18:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by hydrak

Adding a "switch character" button is a bad idea. It will open GW (as it has done to other games) to many hacking exploits, particularly duplicating item exploits.

Let me say this one more time. You cannot be banned for logging in/out of your account hundred of times in a short period of time. Logging in/out hundreds of times may raise a red flag on ANET servers for logfile investigation, but you will not be banned if there is no wrong doing. I've tested this.

Your joking right? This is a bad idea because ANet sucks too much to fix their exploits? This isn't Diablo 2, I expect shit to be done. They made a god damn streaming technology, and can't even utilize 1/10th it's power. Just like how most people who play this game can't utilize 1/10th their brain.

Quote:

Let me say this one more time. You cannot be banned for logging in/out of your account hundred of times in a short period of time. Logging in/out hundreds of times may raise a red flag on ANET servers for logfile investigation, but you will not be banned if there is no wrong doing. I've tested this.

Well whoopdy do, because the other guy just told me the exact opposite. What in blue hell do you think makes you more credible? I offered a fair trial, no matter what status you are, it can't hurt you if you aren't guilty.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damon Windwalker

...it's called a job.

It's called LawSuit. They can't get you if your not stupid.

Quote:

Another reminder to everyone here about how innocent FX8 is... He has just registered on this forum. Up to this point in time, all of his posts are in this thread.

Although all his responses are very innocent, I can't help myself seeing some of HIGH CHUNTAYA in him.

I can see this as a legitimate concern, but I can also say that most people in here like the iQ guys or PANK/TE would not use their "uber guild status" to gain leverage. So why not give him benefit of the doubt?

Fact is, I don't give a damn which side is right, this is a golden chance for gamers to take power, gamers have always been scrapping at the barrel as game companies abused tactic after tactic (FF series turning to SUCK, MMORPGS, Halo 2? GTA:I STOLEZ YOUR BATTLECRUZAR?) and they can get away with it because gamers don't show enough will power to band together. Whenever you get a chance to show that your opinion makes a difference and that you'd walk out, game companies will listen. Now guys like GHM might be taking this a bit ramboish, but the idea is about right ( though since it's PANK, I can't say his demands won't be met...)

SOT · Aug 05, 2005, 06:44 PM // 18:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by hydrak

Care to elaborate that?

No elaboration is needed.

hydrak · Aug 05, 2005, 06:52 PM // 18:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xellos

Well whoopdy do, because the other guy just told me the exact opposite. What in blue hell do you think makes you more credible? I offered a fair trial, no matter what status you are, it can't hurt you if you aren't guilty.

Check this thread carefully before you post, only the OP said the opposite. All other posters in this thread had no problem when logging in/outs many times. Because of this, I did a test and further confirmed what other posters said.